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William Lane Craig vs Alex O’Connor: God and Suffering

Alex O'Connor | May 22, 2026



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– VIDEO NOTES

This event took place on the 5th of May 2026 at the Royal Institution. William Lane Craig and Alex discuss the kalam cosmological argument, whether the universe had a beginning, Hilbert’s Hotel, and the problem of animal suffering.

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Written by Alex O'Connor

Comments

This post currently has 43 comments.

  4. @TheLeonhamm

    May 22, 2026 at 8:25 am

    Great stuff .. and most telling .. if only on the issue of the emptiness of point scoring victory and some befloundering admissions of nescience.

    1) What "is" God; "God", logically speaking, is the one supreme spiritual being, complete in all perfection .. aka "Being" per se. Being, as "Being", is complete in and of itself, it simply is whatever it is, however it is, whenever, and wheresoever, etc. So, "Being" – whatever it is – is an entirely different kind of being from our own; and this Christians (of the Catholic form) used to call "God".

    2) What is "suffering"; pain, as part of suffering (passio .. a passing passion of the animal soul, anima/ psyche, in its form, sense, experience, and mind), is a type of deprivation in an expected "good". A sense of "harm", aka evil (the basic meaning of that term), experienced as a limitation due to loss, through weakness, disease, penalty, or incident .. and thus to be endured, treated, mended or risen above (perhaps, all of these), etc.

    3) Therefore, Being, per se, is not a being of composite parts, a limited animal of dust, slime, breath, thought, and occasional judgment, it is .. simply .. what it is, as above, integrally, without loss, addition, harm, or need; it does not "feel" the passion of loss, however, it "experiences" it – humanly speaking .. in the being of passing animal and material limitations = their growth, decay, dissolution and pain.

    WLC, it seems, is limited by .. or limits himself to .. a slightly narrow expression of this oddly disturbing "reality" suffered within the human experience of being (as anything animal at all), that of opinions on the interpretations of a traditional set of inspired, or at least inspiring, ancient wisdom, aka God's self-revealing "word" committed to man's limited comprehension (poetically, philosophically, theologically, and just plain old common-sensically). AO'C, merrily takes this approach by the heels and gives it a shake, somewhat rationally – though at heart, illogically, if "God", "suffering", and "us" are held in relation, set out above, as kinds of being – and that, alas, is the rather tawdry problem here (.. what, if anything practical, is the notion "all scripture" good for, intended to be, or properly used as ? ..)

    Those customary texts themselves witness to this quirky understanding:

    "But continue thou in those things which thou hast learned, and which have been committed to thee: knowing of whom thou hast learned them; and because from thy infancy thou hast known the holy scriptures, which can instruct thee to salvation, by the faith which is in Christ Jesus. All scripture, inspired of God, is profitable to teach, to reprove, to correct, to instruct in justice, that the man of God may be perfect, furnished to every good work." 2 Tim 3 : 14-17

    AKA They are meant to be used as a helpful tool, inspired and inspiring, for the man contemplating Being, per se, in relation to us, en masse .. not as a Highway Code to contain and/ or accuse him, in thought, word, or deed (even by omission).

    But then, what would I know …

    Keep the Faith; tell the truth, shame the devil, and let the demons shriek.
    God bless. ;o)

  5. @drChaseWebber

    May 22, 2026 at 8:25 am

    Wow so WLC expects us to believe that the only speculation to be dismissed is the naturalistic, but speculation regarding God as cause it totally valid? Let's be clear, both need to be treated equally and examined for the totality of evidence.
    I find it the most narcissistic view that the entirety of every micro-organism, insect, animal challenge for survival with its encompassing suffering is for the purpose of salvation of a single human species …. I may as well start believing in Santa Clause again so that I can feel like a good boy who deserves a gift.

  6. @Donledge

    May 22, 2026 at 8:25 am

    Is animal suffering seriously people’s biggest issue with the existence of God? In their view it’s just the natural world and that’s how the world works. It’s a fallen world….. If God preferred animal suffering why would we live alongside all of them in heaven?

  7. @erickompad8257

    May 22, 2026 at 8:25 am

    I was excited to hear alex's respond to wlc, but when the moderator started coughing, it's so distracting that I lose interest in watching the video. He should've excused himself before alex started talking.

  9. @WungJong

    May 22, 2026 at 8:25 am

    Time is not a dimension we travel across; it is the rate at which the universe computes itself. O'Connor uses mathematical equations to describe time, but fails to realize that math itself requires a mind to validate it.

  10. @davidfrisken1617

    May 22, 2026 at 8:25 am

    Arguments cannot ever be evidence.
    The feelings of uneducated indoctrinated peasants is not ever evidence.
    WLC's feelings are not evidence.

    WLC does not understand math and in particular variables.
    WLC does not understand science.

    WLC has stepped up his dishonesty recently on various youtube channels. is this a related to him getting more incompetent in these discussions?

  12. @bl00m1mgt0n

    May 22, 2026 at 8:25 am

    The sheer terror in the moderator's eyes as he did everything he could to hold back another cough. My dude was in another place completely.

  19. @MrMdubs420

    May 22, 2026 at 8:25 am

    If you experience unexplainable phenomenon then the idea that God exists doesn't seem so strange. The idea that God wouldn't allow suffering or evil is absurd.

  23. @moyga

    May 22, 2026 at 8:25 am

    People who were already religious before ever encountering these arguments like to use them to justify their belief, but I genuinely wonder how many people have actually moved from not believing that a God exists to believing that one does because of arguments like Kalam and 'if we can imagine a God exists it must exist'. I find these arguments so completely unconvincing that I find it amazing that anyone who didn't already believe in God, or have a strong desire for there to be a God, would find them persuasive. Most of these old arguments seem to me like starting with a conclusion they want to be true and then trying to conceptualise everything around trying to make that conclusion true, interpreting everything with that goal, which produces the absolute worst type of academic philosophy in my opinion. Craig has openly admitted himself that he interprets all data and all arguments starting from the assumption that the Christian God exists. Starting with your conclusion and devoting your life to trying to justify it is exactly the wrong way to go about trying to move towards truth. Craig has also admitted that it is impossible for anyone to persuade him that the Christian God does not exist, that even if all the data and logic changed tomorrow and the arguments against its existence were overwhelming, he would believe it.

  27. @jonathanmitchell8698

    May 22, 2026 at 8:25 am

    I think Craig (and the moderator) were way to into the "debate" aspect of this conversation. Things like the problem of animal suffering that Alex brought up are not propositional "dunks" – it's not meant as some kind of gotcha. Real conversations should involve entertaining such challenges rather than dismissing them just because they don't address the rigid propositional framework you've personally built your belief upon.

  28. @bryce9684

    May 22, 2026 at 8:25 am

    All the arguments go back to the dilemma of 3Os(Omniscient, omnipotent and omnibenevolent). If god exist , is this the type of world we would expect from him/her?
    Absolutely not, that's why there's haven.
    Is there any type or sense of free will?
    Yes.
    Then Why didn't god create thy kind at the first place?
    He created it but the first 2 people destroy the perfection.
    Then his creation isn't perfect?
    Yes it is. I just answered you.
    Then haven isn't very promising since you mentioned a perfect creation could be destroy with the weapon of free will. It's the evidence of imperfection isn't it?
    ………
    So.. the explanation of god only raise questions, not an answer. To agnostic, the answer is "i don't know".

  30. @MrMdubs420

    May 22, 2026 at 8:25 am

    I am not a religious person but the argument that God wouldn't allow suffering is flawed. God's plan doesn't have to make sense to us. Suffering is part of his plan.

    God gave people free will for a reason. God doesn't cause suffering, and he didn't create evil.

  34. @IbsSaintLaurent

    May 22, 2026 at 8:25 am

    9:26 "agreed upon by the vast majority of NT scholars" and literally ALL those 4 points are absolutely not agreed upon by the vast majority of new TN and in fact quite the opposite. Intellectual dishonesty and lies in the opening statement already…

  36. @danielfrancis2208

    May 22, 2026 at 8:25 am

    They shouldn't run an event like this and then squash the responses. Make it 3-4 hours and have proper responses or don't do a QNA at all.
    That said, Alex and Bill are both quite funny in their own ways. They're wit and charm did shine at times, if nothing else. Fun discussion, despite the hiccups, or rather…coughs…

  37. @jaredbowen3527

    May 22, 2026 at 8:25 am

    As a Christan animal suffering is by far the hardest thing for me to understand, and the first time I disagreed heavily with something Craig said. I would consider it the most convincing argument against at least theism.
    And yes, I am a vegan.

  39. @armadyl1212

    May 22, 2026 at 8:25 am

    whenever the problem of suffering is put to theists, seems like theistic apologists now wanna severely constrain and weaken god.. "ohh, but maybe god cant create a world without fossil fuels.. this is only the all powerful supernatural creator of the universe we're talking about here, you expect way too much to think he cant create us without fossil fuels!"

  40. @FelipeZabala

    May 22, 2026 at 8:25 am

    @CosmicSkeptic are you EVER going to have a conversation with a Buddhist philosopher or you just don't care about your audience's opinion at all?

  41. @TBT.Stories

    May 22, 2026 at 8:25 am

    i don't know that we need to understand Time to know the problem of infitine regression: either this is a "block universe" where causality is only a concept in the creatures inside… or this is a relational/causal universe where infinit regresion of causal efects (doesn't matter if relative or strictly linear) seems to me to be impossible

    (edit):
    The problem is that we don't accept that the alternative: a begging, is exactly as paradoxical and crazy… saying that there was a point where t=0 is like saying: there was a point where nothing was.
    How does a being (or a cause) outside time, affect a thing that isn't there, and it makes it start to be? How does a think. How long did the cause of the universe wait until It caused it? 😂 this is the same problem as the infinite regression..
    Now of course you can invent an entity, but so can you invent a solution to the problem of infinite regression: namely "it is what it is" 😂… this is exactly as explanatiory as "God did it"…
    I am more inclined to want to believe that meaning exists and that A Will created reality, but no argument seems to be proof, is more like the arguments go against.

  42. @jonrooger

    May 22, 2026 at 8:25 am

    When my Christian grandma was dying, my Christian grandpa didn’t understand why she was sad and depressed.

    “Doesn’t she know she’s going to heaven?” He seemed sincerely confused.

    WLC reminds me of my Christian grandpa.

  43. @armadyl1212

    May 22, 2026 at 8:25 am

    god can create universes, create fine tuning, create life, create heaven and hell, but cant create humans without the need of fossil fuels. ok

Comments are closed.

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