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An Ancient Guide to Happiness – Epicurus on How to Live Well

Alex O'Connor | May 9, 2026



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– VIDEO NOTES

Jonny Thomson is a philosopher and the founder of @philosophyminis. He is on the Executive Board for the British Philosophy Association and is a staff writer at Big Think.

– LINKS

Jonny’s upcoming book, “The Art of Enough: The Ancient Epicurean Philosophy of Finding – and Keeping – Happiness”: https://www.penguin.co.uk/books/477995/the-art-of-enough-by-thomson-jonny/9781847929297

– TIMESTAMPS

00:00 – Are Epicureans Selfish?
05:30 – Why Epicureanism?
10:31 – Who Was Epicurus?
16:42 – Godless But Not Atheistic
23:21 – Epicurus’ Metaphysics
27:24 – Why Focus on Pleasure?
35:29 – Epicureanism vs Utilitarianism
48:59 – What About Immoral Pleasures?
53:02 – Could AI be Epicurean?
01:00:50 – The Experience Machine
01:10:59 – Why Epicurus Didn’t Like Sex
01:16:21 – Are Influencers Watering Down Ancient Philosophy?
01:20:06 – Are You In Control of Your Happiness?
01:26:33 – Epicureanism vs Stoicism
01:32:36 – Epicurus on Death
01:36:42 – Do We Have a Happiness Crisis?

– CONNECT

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The Within Reason Podcast: https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/within-reason/id1458675168

– CONTACT

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Written by Alex O'Connor

Comments

This post currently has 41 comments.

  2. @jandew314

    May 9, 2026 at 8:08 pm

    1:02:50 There's a real analogue to the experience machine issue here. There's plenty of video games that "deceive" the player in subtle, mundane ways, such as running a progress bar nonlinearly (or even moving it when there is no change) so as to encourage a player to keep trying at a difficult task.

    These choices are made in game design bc when playtesters are surveyed on their satisfaction between versions, the version that deceives is more satisfying. This is very analogous to the "5% more enjoyable" example Alex brings up, but the "real world" is just another version of the video game.

    So, is that not confimation of the hypothesis, in a sense? If players don't know the presentation does not honestly correspond to the mechanics of the game, they are more satisfied with the deceptive version. Thus Epicureanism suggests the deception is good, no?

  3. @jandew314

    May 9, 2026 at 8:08 pm

    59:16 I cannot agree with the claim that silicon computation cannot become intimately interrelated with metabolism.

    Silicon chips do require power to run, which can be provided by electric generators running on fuel, thus meeting all basic notions of metabolism. AI training is even analogous to evolution at speed, with a "survival of the fittest" approach to selecting parameters, so if that training is performed for a robot that has obtaining fuel as part of its ability space, it will compute in a way deeply entwined with literal metabolism.

    I guess there can be an argument made around the distinction between individual neurons having mitochondria and thus performing metabolism within the computing units themselves, but… that feels irrelevant here. He's not arguing that brains beget a consciousness thinking about supplying neurons with blood in an intimate way, but that that consciousness thinks about putting food in its mouth in an intimate way.

  4. @jandew314

    May 9, 2026 at 8:08 pm

    46:54 To put a point on Alex's idea, a response to this could call back to the locality of Epicureanism. If a majority of a city has accepted the norm of periodically going in a mob to a racial ghetto and murdering a few "sacrifices" (human scapegoats) to dispel their own anxieties and frustrations… is that not Epicurean in nature?

    Those people still have their own friends, who stood by them in the mob. There's greater solidarity between the people who were in the mob. They do not live in the ghetto, so they don't endure its pain or horror of existence, so they have no Epicurean duty to it by the local nature of Epicureanism.

    At large yet unequal population levels, the Epicurean mindset does indeed seem to problematically endorse and encourage discrimination.

  5. @jandew314

    May 9, 2026 at 8:08 pm

    31:31 you could have finished with "parties… to the contract" (redundant, but accurately so) and "contracting parties" or "signatories" would work if you wanted to be more succinct or versatile.

    "…but also that justice exists within the contract between the signatories."

  7. @P.April123

    May 9, 2026 at 8:08 pm

    1:05:30 I am not sure why he is so resistant to the experience machine conclusion because I really can't see the problem with just accepting pressing the buttom. But others might intuitively not want to press it ? Sure that may just be because they are not truly being epicurean so I don't see the issue

  8. @P.April123

    May 9, 2026 at 8:08 pm

    50:22 I have to say that I am very disappointed by Johnny thomsons responses here towards the critisism raised by alex o Connor. Yes it is trivially true that we would not consider such a society as happy or good because most of us are not epicureans who holds that happiness is just pleasure but this is why alex is raising that criticism towards epicureanism in the first place. It is intuitive that such a society is wrong and unhappy but it prima facie is right or happy under epicureanism and thus epicureans go against our comman intuition.

  11. @mainman2256

    May 9, 2026 at 8:08 pm

    1:07:30 so many ways to play with the experience machine idea. Say he came to you and said you are in the experience machine right now. I know you don't remember anything other than this life, where you love your wife and child, but it is not the real world. Your real wife and child are waiting for you to push this button to exit the machine and your memories from the real world will return. You will remember this world with this wife and child when you wake up but it will go on without you as if you died or disappeared. Do you push the button and leave this life for one you don't remember? Only if you're told you will be happier there? What if you're told you have a happier life here in the machine?

  12. @mainman2256

    May 9, 2026 at 8:08 pm

    45:55 ya there aren't really any universals, especially with morality. Anything like this "what is good" stuff can only be said about "most" people and never 100% of people. There is no such thing as "everyone" wants, or would want, this or that. There only ever had to be one person that did "bad things" and never experienced the negative consequences and died happy with their life. Surely there has been more than one.

  17. @chakadyazdani3229

    May 9, 2026 at 8:08 pm

    I hate that he just refuses to commit to what epicurism implies in these different scenarios. I think that's because he internally believes that morality is universal and that's exactly the opposite of what epicurism is.

  18. @P.April123

    May 9, 2026 at 8:08 pm

    45:13 See this is always my problem with ethical discussions where the only defence an ethical theory have is "Well it's very unlikely to actually happen" but that does not answer the thought experiment. If a person can cause great harm and suffering to other human beings then do they ought inflict that harm under epicurean ethics ? The answer appears to be yes given the avoidance jonny thomson seems to be having and his only defence is to say that such things don't actually happen in reality because it's more likely that a person will suffer more pain than pleasure in reality and therefore should not inflict harm on other human beings. I don't even see an argument for this being true because it could also be the case that the pleasure of hurting others may far exceed the pain it returns which in his example would be the fear that someone might attack the person in return. It would be difficult to quantify how much pain or pleasure we are getting but the point is that a person who holds to an epicurean view can end up finding himself hurting others for pleasure because he is motivated by epicurean philosophy of pleasure and epicureans cannot demonstrate that it's impossible for him to be gaining more pleasure than pain.
    Moreover, Such a view of ethics seems to be a waste. I am not sure why we should continue having ethical talks if good is that which brings me pleasure and bad is that which brings me pain. If morality is simply instrumental then choosing to not harm another human being is the same as choosing to eat a food at a five star restaurant and yet we do not say that I have a moral obligation to eat in a five star restruant.
    Morality has always been viewed from a point of view that seperates good from pleasure and yet when you conflate the two then the entire field of morality becomes redundant

  27. @Koutouhara

    May 9, 2026 at 8:08 pm

    "everyone likes to move towards pleasure and away from pain" (paraphrase)

    BDSM exists, where some types of pain for some is pleasurable

  31. @samuelsmith5828

    May 9, 2026 at 8:08 pm

    Didn't know where to put this so I'll ask you guys: Thought experiment- The is a program, that after it's conclusion, is guaranteed advance humanity by leaps and bounds while also eliminating war, famine, want, ect. But it requires all of us to pay 1 dollar from each of our paychecks in order to achieve this goal. The program will take 3 generations to complete and will have 0 benefits until completion. Do you support this program? I'm curious about weather we care about our species as a whole or just for ourselves/folks we might be more tangibly connected.

  37. @christopherl4611

    May 9, 2026 at 8:08 pm

    Epicurus was a healer… anti-idealism is a potent medicine… I recite the doxai and make homage to Epicurus and his Friends in the Garden because it deeply impacted me and remembering his teaching is my road to mental health. It is a friendly and thankful feeling, not a deferential and totalitarian sentiment. He is an ancient Friend.

  38. @christopherl4611

    May 9, 2026 at 8:08 pm

    Pleasure is a guide emerging, generated or produced in our bodies recognizing the pathos as a moral barometer for the self as well as for what we witness through the sensations and through our anticipations. When we witness horror happening to others, our bodies respond negatively.. our stomach churns, our heart sinks, we may even weep if we have a deeper level of empathy.

    This author is there. I can see the Ataraxic gaze in his eyes.

  39. @ruggedtrash2765

    May 9, 2026 at 8:08 pm

    I think it is a bit naive to think that there are no, or even a scarce population of, individuals who take pleasure in inflicting a dose of pain on other people. Even taking conscience into account, on its spectrum, I would bet a lot of people do not find displeasure in manipulating others to their advantage (just as a small example), resulting in great pain for the manipulated and pleasure to the manipulator. Even with consequences a good chunk of people that live this, lets say, narcicistic life, can move on and have overall a better experience going through life than their victims due to their lack of attachment and emphasis on self pleasure. They have then prioritized their pleasure as an Epicurean and the result of their actions is rather favorable for them, but unfavorable for everyone else.

    I also find it naive to think, now more broadly, that horrible people don't live rather good lives free of consequence for the majority of said life. We have horrible people running countries who died before any consequence, Emperors, and leaders, and heads of households throughout history. I'd say they lived their lives Epicureanistically despite the damage they caused.

    I mean, I'm sure Jack the Ripper didnt retire out of a good conscience or because he finally came to understand he wasnt living up to Epicurean ideals. Im sure he could have easily laughed it off in his deathbed after never having been caught. What is stopping anyone evil enough to do a horrible act enough to maximaize their own pleasure, and stopping right before the consequences come back to bite them.

Comments are closed.

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